estrogen dominance and no boobs

[joyful1]

why would phytoestrogens help someone who is estrogen dominant? I am estrogen dominant, and I am a AAA, so obviously my excess estrogen isn't helping me. How could adding more help me? Should I be using progesterone during my routine? I really believed in BE, but I am getting so discouraged. I've heard it's almost impossible for someone my size not to stall. Is it pointless to keep trying?

[HoneeBee]

herbs like fenugreek and even fennel are not strong estrogens even if you are estrogen dominant they wont affect you like regular estrogen. the problem with having high level of estrogen in your system is that your body doesnt know what to do with all of it so it stops responding to it. if you do truely have an estrogen dominance problem progesterone will help but you will have to do the ramp up method to find a strength that will also encourage NBE. you can get progereone cream at 40mg/oz- 1500mg/oz. a good place to start is between 400-500mg/oz 2x a day.

[connie]

Hi, joy:

It's connie. I have same question as yours and am kind of confused, too. I'm planning to take a break after my cycle 6 finished.

BTW, I've read one article which May help you out I think:

www.totalityofbeing.com/ArchivedBreastShape.html

connie

[joyful1]

Thanks Honeybee. Would I use it my whole cycle and where do I apply it?

[joyful1]

Connie,
I didn't see your message before I responded. I checked out the article and it is very interesting. I also came across this article, which I found interesting too:

www.consumerlab.com/tnp.asp?siteid=consumerlab&docid=/tnp/condition/breast_enhance%20

[connie]

Hi, joy:

Yap, It's really interesting and give me another thought of what we're doing NBE for.

I'm also thinking to try Dr. William Wong's suggestions after my break (I'm a estrogen dominant, too!) cuz I don't have much growth so far even though I still have lots of soreness.

Did you check Annie's current routine, Wonder-Up seems to do wonders on her......I'm so jealous....lol

I'm not giving up , so are you, girl!!!

connie

[joyful1]

I actually applied Progesterone cream directly to my breasts yesterday. I'm thinking about trying it alone, without herbs. I noticed that Fawn said she grew from progesterone cream and testosterone.

Is your soreness internal or is it external like on the skin? If it's external, it could be from the massage which doesn't mean growth.

[angelface]

These articles are very interesting. I am estrogen dominant too. I am wondering if I should be using Progesterone as well. But I thought I read somewhere on this BE board that we were not suppsed to apply the progesterone cream directly to the breasts. Does anyone recall that?

[connie]

Hi, joy:

My soreness is DEEP from inside of my boobs however it seems no BIG growth in going, probably I need some progesterone cream

That's another wonder: why I receive lots of soreness but w/o major growth??

connie

[HoneeBee]

now thats the million dollar question. no one really knows connie. the only true sign of success is in the before and after shot and in the tape measurer.

[joyful1]

angelface,
I did think I heard that about not applying it to the breasts, but then when I read it in that article, it made me wonder. Also, if you are supposed to apply it to thin skin areas, I'd think breasts would be ok. I've actually had pains in my smaller breast today. Hmmm....

[connie]

Hi, joy:

That sounds good, please keep us posted!

Thanks! honeebee, probably what I have to do is : be patient.
BTW, excuse me repeating joy's question, should progesterone cream be used in Luteal Phase or whole cycle?

connie

[joyful1]

I found this, which I thought was interesting:

"Progesterone is one of two main hormones, the other being estrogen, made by the ovaries of menstruating women. Progesterone is also made in smaller amounts by the adrenal glands in both sexes and by the testes in males. When a woman's monthly cycle is functioning correctly, estrogen is the dominant hormone during the first two weeks of the menstrual cycle. In response to ovulation, progesterone assumes dominance for the final two weeks of the month. When the pituitary gland in the brain sends a message to the ovaries to stop production of progesterone, the menstrual cycle begins within 48 hours of this message."

I've heard many women say they experience pains in the luteal phase. This makes me think that if progesterone is possibly aiding in the pains, maybe we should take it during follicular too.

Also,

"One Must take at least three to seven days off (without applying any progesterone cream) every month so that one's body will not develope resistence or tolerance to the cream and become ineffective."

This is from this site (in case anyone wants to see it): tsangenterprise.com/news28.htm

So your question doesn't get overlooked, I'll ask it again Connie:

Can or should we be taking progesterone throughout our cycle? (I actually applied a smaller quantity this morning, which is the first day of my period, and I've felt slight pains.)

[Wahaika]

Progesterone cream has an interesting history on this board. In the days that this was hosted on MSN, it was extremely consistent that when women used progesterone cream it had disasterous effects on their growth. There are two exceptions to this:

1) to use it sparingly on a certain day, maybe two, for the purpose of clearing estrogen receptors to make them more sensitive. As I remember, it was on the mid cycle day and on the last day of the cycle.

2) to use at the end of a long break and during the last week or so of the cycle, as is written in flat-to-fab, again - for the purpose of clearing estrogen receptors.

Remember the purpose of progesterone when it comes to breasts - to build glandular tissue in preparation for pregnancy. Women are cranking it out at about 450 mg per day at that time, compared to about 45 mg per day otherwise. At birth, you have prolactin kicking in to start and maintain the milk supply. Then after breast feeding days are over - psssssssssssst - DEFLATION!

What does this say about progesterone? That any growth is temporary. When you stop the progesterone, the size will eventually go down.

This is not the case with estrogen. Estrogen fills estrogen receptors resulting in fat deposits in those places where those type of cells exist - breasts, butt, thighs, etc.

How does this relate to estrogen dominance? It might not. But estrogen dominance is going to be system wide, not focussed in one place.

If one has a lot of fat in those places, (breasts, butt, thighs, etc. ) the fat itself tends to create it's own aromatase, resulting in the local creation of estrogen, resulting in more fat resulting in more estrogen - you get the idea, it's a vicious cycle. Progesterone, even directly on the breasts is not going to work except for some possibly rare cases as with Dr. Wong's story. Stop the progesterone and the growth will eventually go away.

If one has AAA-AA range breasts, and has a wide rib cage (like 38 or more) then it stands to reason that NBE, perfectly done, is going to take a long time. This is because it takes cells to do this. The fewer cells, the longer it takes to gain the momentum. The ramp up has to be done slower with smaller dosages. It is painstakingly slow, but in time it will work, especially if one has breast fed at least one child.

That's my take.

Wahaika

[Jem]

Joyful I just read this at a site and thought it might interest you in this current topic -

Low "estrogen" is most often seen in petite and/or slim women, most often when menopausal. Estrogen deficiency symptoms are also pronounced in women who have been on synthetic hormones and prescriptions like Premarin and PremPro, and are weaning off or tapering off HRT ERT drugs or have stopped abruptly.
Important Note: Make sure you also take the Progesterone Test!
Women who need Estrogen, must also take Progesterone! Progesterone maintains the body cell's estrogen receptor sensitivity.

It came from here - www.hormoneprofile.com/progesteronetest.htm

I know you said you are estrogen dominant, but thought you might find the link of progest/estrogen interesting, and they also talk about needing to take progesterone if you are estrogen dominant.

Hope it helps
Jem