Greenbush Ramp-Up

[sal]

Thanks Wahaika

ok, well my stats are as follows:

Sex: Female
Weight: 47.6 Kg (i.e. 7.5 stone equivalent to 105 pounds)
No. of Children: zero children
Age: 28 yrs
Breastfed: No
Height: 5 ft 4 inches (164 cm)
Band: 32 inches
Cup: UK size B cup
Width: (i am not sure what part should be measured to get the width)

Hope this is helpful, I'd really like to get a routine going soon.

Also, regarding ramping up e.g."Also, you have given Phase II Ramping Up method up the top of this thread and example is:

"20.....4.....3.....3
21.....5.....3.....3
22.....6.....3.....3
etc."

does that mean I should just ramp up till day 22 and then carry on using the "6.....3.....3" combination of herb pills? or should i ramp up until i hit a day when i see some actual growth, and then stop exceeding/ ramping up my dose, and just stick to the does i took on the previous day before i saw the growth happen?

How much growth would i have to observe before i stopped ramping up and stiuck to the doese that is showing result?

Thanks again Wahaika

[Wahaika]

Sal,

>>"does that mean I should just ramp up till day 22 and then carry on using the "6.....3.....3" combination of herb pills? or should i ramp up until i hit a day when i see some actual growth, and then stop exceeding/ ramping up my dose, and just stick to the does i took on the previous day before i saw the growth happen?

How much growth would i have to observe before i stopped ramping up and stiuck to the doese that is showing result?"


Here is the rest of the pattern:

20.....4.....3.....3
21.....5.....3.....3
22.....6.....3.....3
23.....6.....3.....3
24.....6.....4.....3
25.....6.....5.....3
26.....6.....6.....3
27.....6.....6.....3
28.....6.....6.....4
29.....6.....6.....5
30.....6.....6.....6
31.....6.....6.....6
32.....6.....6.....6

This is just an example because how far you go depends on:
* How many mg's per capsule you are using,
* What your maximum dosages are for estrogenic herbs.

For example, if your max is 3000mg and you are using Greenbush capsules (575mg) then you do not want to exceed 5 capsules per day (2875 mg) per estrogenic herb. The estrogenic herbs that I have in mind are Fenugreek, Fennel and Wild Yam. Galega and Red Clover are also estrogenic but the dosages for those are different (lower).

You should be OK at around 3000 mg per day as a 32B. I don't know what the differences are between a U.K 32B and a U.S. 32B.

The idea is to ramp up until you feel "growing pains" which could be deep aches, itches, etc. When you feel those strongly, stay at the dosage that caused them until you grow some. When you grow (like 1/2 inch, and your growing pains disappear, you will have enough new tissue that you need more herbs to support it, so you ramp up a little further until the growing pains return.

Not everyone feels growing pains, so if you find that you are in that category, then you stick with your maximum dosages for 6 months. The other choice is to try different things to get the growing pains, but again, if you are one of those that grows without necessarily feeling growing pains, then you are in for some frustration trying to get them. But there are those who do search around and try different things and then get growing pains, so it all depends on what you want to do. Personally, I think seeking the growing pains is the best way to go.

Another thing. You are looking for growing pains in the first half of your cycle when estrogen gets to its highest. Growth during the second half is referred to luteal swelling and is temporary. Estrogen falls off at that time but comes back a little before dropping again. Progesterone also ramps itself up at this time. So if you get growing pains in the luteal phase, remember those dosages and then wait to see what effect you get in the follicular phase (first half of cycle). It could be that you only need to add or subtract a little to keep them going the entire time.

See how much work you're in for?!

Wahaika

[snowqueen67]

So wahaika... why do I get most of my pains in the luteal phase? This is confusing me no end. Before I started NBE never had any swelling at any time. Now I hit day 20 (of my 31 day cycle) and I am soooo sore, shooting pains all over my breasts. This cycle, they are even more swollen than usual. Please tell me this moght be a good thing??

rebecca

[magooch]

Do the max dosages that you describe not apply to saw palmetto, since it's a DHT blocker?

[Wahaika]

snowqueen67,

OK, it might be a good thing.

How's that! HA!

Seriously, it might be a good thing, but it depends on if you are keeping any growth from month to month. Are you?

[Wahaika]

magooch,

Correct. Saw Palmetto does not have the same limitations. I believe it was Fawn who had it up to 5 or 7 grams per day at one point. I'd have to go look that up. But, yep, SP can go higher than the Estrogenic herbs.

[snowqueen67]

wahaika said:

snowqueen67,

OK, it might be a good thing.

How's that! HA!

Seriously, it might be a good thing, but it depends on if you are keeping any growth from month to month. Are you?

To be honest, I don't know any more...my measurements seem to be all over the place. Certainly I am much bigger than when i started 6 mths ago...but as to whether I have grown in my last few cycles, I don't know. My problem seems to be that I seem to respond well in terms of sensations - but its just whether those sensations are DOING anything. I also think, b/c I am wide chested it takes a long time to "see" growth.

rebecca

[Wahaika]

Yep, if you are wide chested it does take longer to see it.

Wahaika

[sal]

wahaika said:

For example, if your max is 3000mg and you are using Greenbush capsules (575mg) then you do not want to exceed 5 capsules per day (2875 mg) per estrogenic herb. The estrogenic herbs that I have in mind are Fenugreek, Fennel and Wild Yam. Galega and Red Clover are also estrogenic but the dosages for those are different (lower).

You should be OK at around 3000 mg per day as a 32B. I don't know what the differences are between a U.K 32B and a U.S. 32B.

Hi Wahaika,

Many thanks for your advice, above.

The UK 32B size is equivalent to a US 32A and I wanted to just ask if the above advice still applies to me. i.e. is 3000mg of Fenugreek a day still ok for me or do i need to increase/ reduce it?

ALso, is it 3000mg FG a day in total intake, or is it 3000mg 3 times a day?

Also, how many mg each of Wild Yam and Saw Palmetto should I take in total of each herb on a daily basis? is it still 3000mg of WY and 3000mg SP too?

Also, should i take Fennel on top of taking WY, FG and SP?

Thanks in advance,

sal

[Wahaika]

Sal,

>>"The UK 32B size is equivalent to a US 32A and I wanted to just ask if the above advice still applies to me. i.e. is 3000mg of Fenugreek a day still ok for me or do i need to increase/ reduce it?"

I would say that a 32A could still use 3000mg (per day) as a maximum. Pay attention to your growing signs/pains and you will probably hit it before that point.

>>"ALso, is it 3000mg FG a day in total intake, or is it 3000mg 3 times a day?"

3000mg is per day.


>>"Also, how many mg each of Wild Yam and Saw Palmetto should I take in total of each herb on a daily basis? is it still 3000mg of WY and 3000mg SP too?"

WY is the same as with Fenugreek. SP can go to 5000mg per day if needed. But 5000mg per day is later if you are trying to adjust things that aren't working.

>>"Also, should i take Fennel on top of taking WY, FG and SP?"

Fennel Tea, yes. Fennel powdered herbs/capsules, no. Don't take fennel except as a tea.

Wahaika
(yep, I'm supposed to be gone, but I was home sick today and decided to have a closer look.)

[sal]

Thanks again Wahaika! that's great!

Just a question really, I am due to start the programme as you suggested, today, as its day 1, but don't have Wild Yam capsules at the moment and can only get them tomorrow, is it a problem if i miss it out for a day? but i use FG and SP today ?

Thanks

[joyful1]

Sal,
He was going to take a break from the board so he may not respond. Have you already ramped up to these dosages or is this your first cycle. If it's your first cycle, you wouldn't use WY today anyway. If it's not your first cycle, it should be ok. Just start it tomorrow.

[Wahaika]

Hi Sal,

Lucky you cought me today. I am home from work today. You will need fenugreek alone on your first day for one dosage.

30 minutes before meals or 2 hours after:

Day one: One capsule of fenugreek.
Day two: One capsule of fenugreek in the AM, one in the PM. Total of 2 this day.
Day three: One capsule of fenugreek in the morning, one in mid day, one at night. Total three today.
Day four: repeat day 3.
Day five: repeat day 3.
Day six: While doing day 3 with fenugreek, take one SP in the morning.
Day seven: Do day six, but add an additional SP in the evening.
Day eight: Now you are up to two fenugreek capsules and two saw palmetto capsules - three times per day.
etc.

That's how the chart in madredesiete's routine works.

Day...FG...SP...WY
1.......1.....0.....0
2.......2.....0.....0
3.......3.....0.....0
4.......3.....0.....0
5.......3.....1.....0
6.......3.....2.....0
7.......3.....3.....0
8.......3.....3.....0
9.......3.....3.....1
10.....3.....3.....2
11.....3.....3.....3
etc.

So you won't need any Wild Yam until day nine.

Hmmm. Maybe that chart needs some work to be more clear. I'll work on that.

Wahaika

[Wahaika]

Hi Joyful1,

Yes indeed, I am really not here. But since I was home from work sick today I decided to drop in.

C'ya!

Wahaika

[caligirl]

hi wahaika,
i browsed through this thread quickly, so pardon me if i missed this but could you please tell me what the ingredients (and their amounts) would be for the booby batter if we are using fenugreek extract as opposed to the fenugreek powder? can we make a large batch of the mixture ahead of time so we wouldn't have to mix everything individually every time? thank you!