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Post by Wahaika on Jul 9, 2005 20:59:50 GMT -5
>>Just wondering, what is the "profile" that you consider to be ideal for a routine like this or Pammy's?
Best case would be: Mid 20's to mid or late 30's. Not perimenopausal. Originally a B cup, swelled to at least D during the months of breastfeeding at least one child. Currently a B cup, even if saggy/deflated. Engages in exercise and a good diet. Gets plenty of sleep. Starts routine in March or April. (i.e. Early Spring) Uses potent herbs like Greenbush. Does an effective massage routine. Does not give up. Does what is required with good frequency. Does not have a fatty back, hips, thighs, butt, or stomach to the point that all the herbs get attracted to those areas. Some weight gain is natural while on a routine. Some exercise and skin brushing can counter this.
>>do you start to ramp up when you start getting growing signs or do you ramp up when you don't get any signs?
>>How long do you give the dosages before you ramp up? What amount should not be exceeded?
The ramp up starts on cycle day 1 and continues until growth signs are the strongest, or until they are felt plus a little more, so that the dosages are as solid as possible but the stall wall is still out of reach. If there are no growth signs at all, (shooting from the hip here) then you go to 3000mg/day if B cup and above. For those below B, 1500 to 2000 mg/day - the smaller the size (cup and rib taken into account), the smaller the max dosage. So a 32AA would lean toward 1500 max and a 38AA would lean toward 2000 max.
Give it a month but evaluate as you go if it is making a difference. Some women never experience growing pains but grow fine. Get help from other women who have grown successfully as a reality check. Also remember that there are no guarantees. Some women just do not grow on herbs. There are other options besides herbs.
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Post by idontmeasureup on Jul 10, 2005 11:31:54 GMT -5
I see. I'm 28, no children, and a small 34C cup. My measurements are: Underbust = 29 inches, Right Breast = 9 inches, Left Breast = 9.5 inches. I would say my body type is Visionary according to that chart everyone on here uses. I'm trying to dowse from the Flat2Fab routine and I'm getting yes's for: saw palmetto, fenugreek, and wild yam. I'm getting no's for: licorice, red clover, and hops. I've been doing the 360 inward massage rotations morning & night for a few days and my breasts do look slightly fuller and I'm mid-cycle, still about 14 days or so away from my period. With that being said, and given my starting size, would 3000 mg/day be the max for me? Thanks!
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Post by Wahaika on Jul 10, 2005 19:15:01 GMT -5
Yep, I would say 3000mg is your max without hitting the stall wall except for saw palmetto which is OK to go higher.
What do you use for massage?
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Post by idontmeasureup on Jul 10, 2005 20:25:56 GMT -5
I haven't started my routine yet, but will be in about 2 weeks. I will be using fenugreek at night and either hops or wild yam in the morning. So, its OK to take more than 3000 mg/day of saw palmetto. I got mine from Greenbush & it says to take 1-3 pills 2-3 times a day. I'm also trying to dowse from the Flat2Fab routine which stuff would be the most effective for me. So far I've gotten yes's for saw palmetto, fenugreek & Wild yam. I've gotten no's for licorice, red clover and hops.
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Post by Wahaika on Jul 10, 2005 22:19:18 GMT -5
Looks like you are ready to go. Don't forget to ramp up. Also, you might consider 2 drops of 99% pure DMSO for the massage with whatever extract you use - fenugreek or wild yam. Don't forget the heat and don't use plastic wrap if you use DMSO. Good luck! 11/06/08: Red Clover and licorice are usually ineffective.
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Post by idontmeasureup on Jul 11, 2005 8:32:52 GMT -5
I was actually gonna use Emu Oil, I"ve heard its just as effective as DMSO, without the smell or the skin irritations. Also, I know that you don't approve of using red clover for BE. I really don't want to use it either. What is a good substitute?
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Post by Wahaika on Jul 11, 2005 23:46:47 GMT -5
I don't think you need a substitute for Red Clover. My main complaint about Red Clover is that the resulting growth appears to be temporary. So if someone did use it, they might do another 6 months of a routine with an herb known to cause permanent growth like fenugreek.
Emu oil looks like a good thing to use. I was worried about it being tryglyceride but evidentally the anti-inflammatory effects outweigh the potential cholesterol problems. I still have the concern, but just don't have the support behind the theory given the track record of emu oil. Bypassing the liver with pure triglyceride just doesn't sound right, to me, for someone fighting high cholesterol.
Good luck.
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Post by idontmeasureup on Jul 12, 2005 8:56:15 GMT -5
I didn't realize that emu oil could cause a problem with cholesterol. I've done a lot of reading about it,but never read anything to that effect. I jsut wanted to stay away from the "shellfish" smell of DMSO. Even just 1-2 drops of Emu oil could cause a problem?
Actually, in my dowsing, I found that red clover isn't for me. I decided to dowse from the routine in the Flat2Fab book, which I'm glad that I did. Oh, I deleted the PM thing, too. Don't know if Wen's deleted hers. Thanks.
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Post by Wahaika on Jul 12, 2005 22:13:56 GMT -5
I don't have any idea how much emu oil to use. Someone else may know that.
I don't think a few drops is going to be a problem.
Call your doctor and get a copy of your bloodwork. You can compare the numbers from it the next time blood is taken. Then you will have proof of whether emu oil makes a difference in lipids or not. Watch the triglyceride, HDL, LDL, VLDL, and C-Reactive Protein numbers.
Update: Emu oil is no longer recommended even in theory. Dowsing is not something that I recommend. Further, if one is going to dowse or rely on someone to dowse, please do not ask for my opinion. Dowsing has too many problems and I offend too many women with the facts.
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Post by idontmeasureup on Jul 13, 2005 9:08:58 GMT -5
Thanks for all those great articles. I was planning to use a little emu oil mixed in with some other lotion, just gotta get a bottle of it & see how greasy it really is. I do have a copy of my lab report & hoping that since I've really changed my diet for the better---no more homemade tamales---that will also impact my numbers too. I might try DMSO in a future cycle, but since I"m so new to the BE stuff, the only other products I ever used was Bloussant for a month & Grobust for 2 months, I really don't know if I'd know the difference between growing itches & the DMSO making my skin itch. I remember when I tried to the use the Brava that my boobs would itch even after having the domes off all night long. I hated the Brava, it was way to confining for me & I thought I could've worn it to work. Yeah right. So, in a nutshell, this is my first real attempt at BE other than commercial pills & even though I've been on the NBE Quest forum for 6 months or so, I'm still very new to this whole idea. I just want to read & learn everything I can for now to help me out once I get rolling. Thanks for the great reference stuff about emu oil.
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Post by hulagirl on Jul 17, 2005 22:06:08 GMT -5
Hi! I was wondering if you could help me with a problem ( I think). I have been taking a BE product which has alittle bit of al the herbs in it for 7 weeks now. I just within the last 2 weeks started doing Lucille's routine that she has in her book, I am still taking the BE pills also. Here is my routine: Morning- fenugreek 690 mg Red Clover 375 mg S Palmetto 275 mg Afternoon the same thing Night- fenugreek 690 mg S Palmetto 275 mg gaba 1500 mg I do massage every morning with fennel and at night I do it with fenugreek, cayenne pepper, red clover and licorice. Here is the thing, In the beggining I had ALOT of soreness(pain) and they felt very heavy especially in the morning when I would first get out of bed. so much so that every morning I would swear that I had grown. Once I got my period everything went away, they deflated. I had read your thread and decided to take a break for a day. I did it on the day I ovulated. I didn't take a single pill or do any massage. Well let me tell you, I had the same soreness that I had when I first started taking the bE pills. The next day I went back to taking everything like I am supposed to and guess what, the achyness went away (slowly) and now it is 3 days after my break day and they are only a very little sore but only if I squeeze a little bit. Am I doing something wrong, why would they start to hurt and feel heavy again when I stopped taking the herbs? I don't know what to do now, I know that if I stop altogether they will go away completely. i have grown about a half of an inch in each breast and I don't want to lose it. Do you think that my doses are to high? I was thinking of ramping up because they were not hurting anymore but now I do not know what to do. Please, please if you can think of anything please write back and let me know or if anyone has a thought please. I have only gained a littl but I realy like and I don't want it to go anywhere and also if I can do anything to make it start up again I want to do it. Thanks a million!
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Post by Wahaika on Jul 17, 2005 23:32:54 GMT -5
Hello hulagirl,
I need to know more information:
I need a stats page to get an idea of what these herbs are going into. Use Vickie's stats, and mgd1 or Littlelamb's as a template to form your own.
Did I read right - you are taking Tobustan along with the listed dosages? If so, how much, how often? If not, what are you taking?
How long are you doing massage? Are you following with 30 min of heat? Are you using pre-made extracts or your own batter for massage? Are using anything as a carrier such as olive oil, emu oil, DMSO, etc.?
Thanks,
Wahaika
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Post by hulagirl on Jul 18, 2005 7:44:56 GMT -5
I'm not exactly sure what my stats are but I'm an A cup. I weigh 150 lbs, I don't know what my blood type is and I think I am a nurturer ( I was reading somewhere about that but I don't know where so I am going from memory). I am taking Tobustan 3 times per day, I added the amounts in the Tobustan to the amounts for the herbs I mentioned. I am doing 360 rotations every morning and every night, it takes about 5 minutes or so to do it. I make my own batter, I put 1 dropperful of each in a lotion that has vitamin E in it. I put a heating pad on at night for I'm sure at least a half of an hour becaue usually I forget and I fall asleep. In th emornigs I don't put any heat on but I just got the bustbuddies and I am going to try them today. I forgot to mention that since I started this new routine(about two weeks ago) my libido has gone way down. I am 35 years old and for the last couple of years my sex drive has gone sky high, I don't know if it is because my kids are not little bitty any more or if I hit my prime but now I almost have no sex drive. I am also VERY dry like when I was a teenager( my husbandand I have been together since I was 16) He has asked what is wrong and I just tell him that my hormones are adjusting. I don't know if that means that I am doing something wrong or not, it seems kinda weird though. If I can get bigger boobs then I can live with this(for awhile) but I sure do hope that it doesn't take too long. Thanks so much for helping me out.
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Post by boobiusmaximus on Jul 18, 2005 11:29:20 GMT -5
hulagirl
progesterone cream helped me with my dryness and my libido. adding saw palmetto 2 weeks ago has sent my libido through the roof. i am a mother of several little ones and in my late 30's. had also been noticing dryness and decreased libido until adding these things.
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Post by hulagirl on Jul 18, 2005 18:30:58 GMT -5
i'm sorry I wasn't thinking but my Saw Palmetto is 1,310, I was only counting one dose I think. Sorry. I didn't know that I could do progesterone cream.
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