Saw Palmetto-DHT

[mominator]

I found this thread while transferring yesterday...it's VERY interesting and would like to see further investigation or sources on it....if anyone could help...I think it's a real FIND! Or help break it down for us fenugreek impaired. ;D

From: Elenacamro Sent: 7/15/2003 8:42 PM
Hi! actually, Breeze, saw palmetto does boost the libido while being an anti-androgen, indeed. I know it sounds crazy, but it is possible... that's because there is not only one form of testosterone molecules. There are many types and kinds of male hormones, so when we say "testosterone", we might actually be referring to one of those various kinds of androgenic molecules and substances. There is one kind of testosterone that is related to male and female hair loss, increased oil production by sebaceous glands, hirsutism, policystic ovarian syndrome, among other side effects, which is the 5- (something) sorry I can't recall it now androsterone.Some women make more or it , or do produce it in normal amounts but are way sensitive to the male hormones in their bodies and get some of the "bad" side effects from some of those male hormones. Men also get "bad" side effects from some forms of male hormoens, and trhe enlargement of the prostate is one of them, for example. Saw is a substance that does not really act as an anti-ALL androgens, but inhibits the action of some "bad" forms of testosterone AND help at letting the NATURAL progesterones role to be fulfilled more efficiently in the body. See, sometimes, male hormones "take the place" of progesterone in the woman's body and/or the woman's body does not take full advantage of the progesterone she is actually producing because of the the male hormones' excess or oversensitivity getting on the way.
Saw palmetto promotes the production and full use of the natural progesterone while inhibiting the action of that "bad" form of make hormones. So it acts as an anti-androgen in a way, while helping the body to take better advantage of the natural progesterone. And the "good" thing about NATURAL progesterone (not the synthetic kind of progesterone, that one kind of has the opposite effects sometimes) is that it increases the sex drive and regulates the production and action of estrogens, regulating hormonal imbalances and helping estrogen make its work in a better way (so if your boobs were small out of a certain lack of estrogen, they will benefit from the progesterone action increasing the estrogen action).
Hope it didn't sound too confusing!

[Wenonae]

Ya know, re-reading this...it does make some sense in that by allowing natural progesterone levels to rise, it would help boobie growth.

As you all may or may not remember (refer to that handy chart in BE Lingo), natural progesterone in the body can be converted to a type of estrogen. So this could explain exactly why SP berries help maintain size.

The question remains..why do some women LOSE libido..while others it increases?

Guess I'll have to some searching on the different types of androgen/testosterone....are they the same or not.

[mominator]

Okay...here's some research Still trying to figure it all out...but thought I would post it for other's to review!

www.gettingfit.com/andro.html

[mominator]

DHT...the medical term is... dihydrotestosterone
(my head is hurting here! )


www.keratin.com/ac/baldnessbiology/baldnessbiochemistry/008dheaconversiontodihydrotestosterone.shtml

[mominator]

In women, androgens are present, principally as androstenedione, which can be converted to testosterone and dihydrotestosterone as needed.

Androgens and oestrogens are concerned in the development and maintenance of secondary sexual characteristics, such as breasts, external genitalia, body hair distribution and so on. Male pattern baldness is to some extent determined genetically, and may be countered in women by the presence of oestrogens.

However preoccupied the TG community is with androgens and oestrogens, they seem to have little interest for endocrinologists. There is very little about them in the textbooks, and Rose(3) in his book The Chemistry of Life barely mentions them at all.

Complicating the issue is the fact that there is actually a family of different oestrogens and androgens, which may be converted from one to another at the point of action.

www.gender.org.uk/about/06encrn/62_hormn.htm

[mominator]

More research! ;D

Pharmacology
Studies have shown that Saw Palmetto extract reduced the uptake, in tissue specimens ,of both testosterone and dihydrotestosterone (DHT) by more than 40%. Other studies have shown that Saw Palmetto inhibits the conversion of the less active testosterone to the more active DHT by inhibiting the enzyme 5 alpha reductase. Hence Saw Palmetto, by blocking the binding of DHT to nuclear receptor sites and inhibiting the conversion of testosterone to DHT ....

www.rxmed.com/b.main/b3.herb.monos/b3.1.monographs/saw.palmetto.html

This is further explaining what Elana had posted in the original post of this thread.

Am I confusing EVERYONE YET! Also in this article is the following.

Indications & Historical Uses
Benign prostatic hypertrophy.

Prostate inflammation.

Impotence, low libido.

Urinary tract disorders, nocturia, enuresis.

Treatment of Male Pattern Baldness.

Female infertility.

May increase breast size in women.

Male and female aphrodisiac.

Anti-inflammatory agent.

Appetite stimulant.

General nutritional tonic to increase muscle strength.

By George...I think I've found it! Phew! Now I can sleep! Well...almost haven't found the "progesterone" link yet...but I will! (feeling like a mad scientist;)