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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:01:19 GMT -5
From: gigi (Original Message) Sent: 5/6/2003 8:41 PM
What is the role of Saw Palmetto in herbal breast enhancement?
gigi
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:01:41 GMT -5
From: Mominator5 Sent: 5/6/2003 9:29 PM
Hi Gigi,
There's finally a post on Womyns Web. I really liked that forum, but it died fast, figures just when I joined it. Anyway, the information I can find on SP, I found on Greenbush, it says it has been a long time Breast Enhancer. There are several uses for it, including prostrate enlargement (I don't need that), and an aphrodesiac. And breast enhancement! Are you on a BO program or herbs, or both?
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:02:00 GMT -5
From: gigi Sent: 5/6/2003 10:38 PM
Hi Mominator,
I'm only on herbal BE again with a dramatically lower dosage and without saw palmetto and wild yam. I know that some of the members here are on BO and saw palmetto is recommended for that course. My question is whether saw palmetto is as effective with the herbal course. Fenugreek, wild yam, and red clover are phytoestrogens but how does saw palmetto complement that?
The other question I have is for Fawn or anyone else who's pleased with yohimbine. Do you realize results gradually i.e. your clothing starts fitting better? What about the skin that's been distended-how is that affected?
gigi
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:02:58 GMT -5
From: Mominator5 Sent: 5/7/2003 5:42 AM
Hi Gigi,
I guess the question is really have you grown without SP? If so, you don't need it. If not, maybe it's something to add after your next cycle. I have only been on 2 products HBA, which does have SP, and Greenbush's Enhancement Cap, also has Wild Yam. I tried Northwest Nutrition's "Bustimluator",but it had black cohosh, and it really messed up my cycle. So I stopped that after 3 days. And my period stopped finally too! I really believe it was the Black cohosh that caused it, lovely having my period for 8 days! Arrrrgh! And they pulled that product from their web site, and refunded my money. So I'm thinkin' I am not the only one who experience trouble!
Momi'
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:03:14 GMT -5
From: ayact Sent: 5/7/2003 6:50 AM Hi Gigi & Mominator, What I learned from this board about Saw Palmette is that it has an antiandrogenic effect. SP can suppress excessive androgen, so may be SP works for feminization  ayact |
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:03:30 GMT -5
From: Patty Sent: 5/7/2003 9:00 AM
Gigi,
To reply to you question about yohimbine HCL (hydrochloride). I am using Lipoderm-Y, which is about $42 for one pump and I have noticed a reduction of about 1"+ on my thighs, stomach and hips. It seems that the solution also makes your fat cells retain water and then when you stop the yohimbine (which I do every 2-3 weeks of application) it releases the water. My pants are definitely loose on those areas now, that's how I first noticed that the yohimbine was working, I had no more trouble getting my pants buttoned and even had to buy new panties as the old ones were too big . When I checked my legs I also noticed that the cellulite is not as pronounced as it used to be and that my saddlebags had had a dramatic reduction in proportion. The stuff really works, especially if combined with diet and exercise. I plan to buy another bottle soon.
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:03:49 GMT -5
From: fawnmarie42 Sent: 5/7/2003 9:06 AM
SP is an anti androgen (which is why it is used for men with enlarged prostates).
There seems to be a bit of a debate whether androgens (testosterone) can affect breast size or not. Some sources say no, no effect. Some say yes - it can cause whithering and shrinkage. Some like our friend Bob say that it is needed for aromatization to estrogen in breast tissue.
The answer is possibly yes to all three.
For some women, androgens will make no difference.
For some, excess will cause shrinkage.
For some, perhaps testosterone WILL aromatize.
The only medical source I found for data was several transgender-oriented doctors and websites who stated that excess testosterone WOULD interfere with growth for men who are in transition (i.e. not yet had the operation with full gonads, but taking estrogen and "prepping" for surgery). For these people, anti-androgens were recommended.
This leads me to think that perhaps adding saw palmetto would be a good idea, specifically for those of us who are producing higher levels of androgens. Without lab tests, the best way to determine this is compare levels of libido, hirsuitism (hairyness) and even acne with women of the same age. If libido is extremely high, excess hair is apparent, and acne is a bit much, then saw palmetto would be recommended. Also, women with a history of ovarian cysts, especially PCOS (polycystic ovarian syndrome) definitely should add it to their list.
Saw Palmetto works by blocking androgen receptors - they are an antogonist - at the actual site. They block the receptors so one's natural androgens can't fit. It does not reduce the actual amount of androgens being produced.
So, judging by existing standards you can get a good idea of how you want to use it. If your androgen levels are relatively normal, or your sex drive is low, you might only want to use it topically at the site. Many of the topical BE formulas contain saw palmetto. OR - you can mix up some extract with aloe.
If you have PCOS or cysts or hirsuitism, you might also want to take it internally.
It isn't that it is recommended with BO - but that it can be used with BO as a "booster" since it doesn't block estrogen receptors. (I've found conflicting data on this, but most sources references stated that it only blocked androgen receptors and more specifically kept testosterone from converting to DHT.)
Fawn
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:04:38 GMT -5
From: Mominator5 Sent: 5/7/2003 9:23 AM
Hi Fawn,
Thank you for that information. I suspect I have PCOS, although NOT diagnosed, the next time I see my gyno, I am going to question. I have several of the signs and have had them since I was about 18. Unwanted hair, skin flags, ovarian cysts (oh so painful), shrinking breast. And I have responded well to BE herbs, my cysts have seemed to disappear, haven't had an attack for 8 months, and I was having attacks almost monthly. Never had an acne problem, but I don't get the once a month mega zit anymore either. So thank you once again! YOU ARE A WONDERFUL SOURCE OF INFORMATION! And I guess the SP has been a very good thing for me!
Momi'
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:04:51 GMT -5
From: Mansi Sent: 5/7/2003 10:02 AM
Hi Fawn,
I suffer from extremely low libido. How much SP should I be taking. I am currently taking 3000 mgs of SP.
Mansi
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:05:43 GMT -5
From: Mominator5 Sent: 5/7/2003 10:34 AM
Hi Mansi,
I should ask the same question, cuz I am not sure how much I should be taking with signs of PCOS, cuz I am not finding any information on the net, other than there nothing really that can be done about it.
Fawn,
How many mg should I be taking to help with the effect I explain in post above? I am currently taking about 1170 mg (included in the Enhancement Capsules)?
Momi'
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:06:03 GMT -5
From: fawnmarie42 Sent: 5/7/2003 11:29 AM
Mansi,
If you have a low-libido and it is a problem for you, then you should switch to taking your SP topically if possible.
If the low libido is not a problem, continue as you are with 3000 mgs, empty stomach, split into three doses.
Mominator - Add another 1,000 - 1,500 mgs per day aside from your composite pills. Again, empty stomach, split dosage. You can get SP cheap at Walmart, 475 mg capsules, take 1 each along with your other herbs.
Fawn
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:06:18 GMT -5
From: breeze Sent: 5/7/2003 2:01 PM
Hi Fawn,
I've read in several places that Saw Palmetto is used as an aphrodisiac as well, however, this contradicts with it being an anti-androgen. Are people just mistaken that it is an aphrodisiac? Or is there another explanation for this?
breeze
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:06:33 GMT -5
From: fawnmarie42 Sent: 5/7/2003 2:16 PM
Not sure why it is considered an aphrodisiac, unless it is somehow related to easing prostate discomfort in older men.
Fawn
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:06:49 GMT -5
From: Mansi Sent: 5/7/2003 6:01 PM
Hi Fawn,
I know SP is very imporatnt for BE. So for some time I will keep libido aside and concentrate just on BE. And then I will do something about libido also (do not know what, but something)!
I ahve ordered SP extract over the internet for topicals but i have not yet received it, some delays. The moment I get them, I will start with SP topically also and will keep you updated.
Thanks
Mansi
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Post by Moderator on Nov 9, 2003 17:07:03 GMT -5
From: gigi Sent: 5/7/2003 7:45 PM
Thanks Patti,
After a multiple pregnancy my stomach is somewhat distended and I was told that a tummy tuck is the only solution. My abs are tight but the skin over them is loose with a layer of fat beneath. I realize that a topical fat burner like Yohimburn won't necessarily eliminate all of the excess but it should minimize some of it. Since I also gained weight with the herbal BE any help would be appreciated.
gigi
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