help

[dafodil]

Hello out there..I really need help now...I was on sbs and after about six months all I noticed was a little fullness but not much change at all..Thats when I found the BE Board and started reading ..with sbs I did notice (after painfully quitting coffee altogether) that my PMS (pretty severe) went away !!Also, all my life I have had very heavy periods that lasted up to 10 days and with sbs my periods also became manageable for the first time in my life..well, all that was great but my breasts weren't getting any bigger..To add to the equation, I had just weaned my two year old right before going on sbs and also have a 5 year old that I nursed until he was 3.and I am 46, I'm really not kidding about all this..Sooo..here's the biggest problem ..I just got the enhancement blend formula from Greenbush because I decided to try something differnt..I began to take only one capsule 3x a day and also the liquid in juice 3x a day..I began this( and massage with the liquid) on the first day of my period..here's what happened: I had the worst cramps that I've ever had in my life and my period was very very heavy..I had headaches and felt horrible and dizzy..Could this be the herbs or the fact that I weaned myself of the sbs or just a strange period..I really want to try the Greenbush herbs but could they be doing this to me.. I can't afford to keep trying so many differnt things and I really want help both wih my cycle and BE..THanks for listening ..Dafodil

[Wahaika]

Hello dafodil,

It sounds to me like you have a few things going against you and a few going for you.

1. My wife (see madredesiete's routine in the routine's section) has noticed when she is on herbs her cycle is lighter when she goes on a break her first couple of cycles are heavier then usual. They then return to what they were before she started herbs. If it doesn't clear up on it's own you can use a good progesterone cream. If you are perimenopausal, that will contribute to the problem.

2. Always take a break for at least one cycle when switching products.

3. Ramp up slowly when doing Greenbush herbs as they are fresh and potent. Greenbush herbs highly recommended.

4. Separate herbs, as in the 90 day kit, are better than the enhancement blend. You have more control and can introduce herbs one at a time to see what may be giving you problems. Fenugreek is famous for some of the things you mentioned. The headaches can be countered with hard candy. Red Clover can also be used but I have never seen anyone keep their growth when using it. (Another subject)

5. It appears that you may being taking to much internally. Check your dosages. You may be getting too much. Five grams per day, per estrogenic herb (or equivalent of extracts), is the absolute maximum or you stall. Write to Joel and ask him what the equivalent amount is. Joel's email = [e-mail].

6. Massaging with extracts is very good, but again, use individual ones like Fenugreek or Fennel. The enhancement blend has Saw Palmetto in it. While OK internally, you don't want to use it in massage.

I would say that you are getting too much of everything. Stop for a cycle or two and restart. See the routine linked to above. It works well.

Good luck!

Wahaika

[gigi]

Hi Dafodil,
Been there done that, take a break. You probably needed to wean yourself off the sbs, take a break, and then start the new herbs gradually. When I stopped breast feeding I thought I'd gone into early menopause-it felt miserable. Wahaika is right about individual herbs and gradually introducing them into your system. Having taken Greenbush herbs I didn't respond well to the wild yam. I also need less than is recommended but that's something that has to be determined individually. Perhaps you can get a small amount of fenugreek, fennel, and saw palmetto to start and store the enhancement blend for a time. If your trials go well with those, start the enhancement blend liquid with small amounts and work your way up to the caps. Good Luck.

[dafodil]

Wow!!this board is amazing..The response to my questions was immediate.Thank you so much for your replys...Well..One thing I didn't mention is that I also weigh 105..I'm a rather small person..Another question..After I take a break from the herbs, and if I get the individual herbs, then how in the world does one measure them?? I'm begining to wonder if this is all worth it..It really is quite expensive..another question..why are members on more than one board?? Do individual vitamins get in the way of progress, because I also take lots of supplements..like ester-C and E and co-q and b12 and more..you all are great help!!thanks Dafodil

[dafodil]

hey Wahaika wow..Your wifes routine looks very complicated and I dont really understand alot of it ..Mainly the measurements..If it's not too much trouble could you summerize in a way that makes it more simple for me to understand . The ramp up section ..Is day one the first menstrating day??You are very hellpful and I really appreciate if..Thank you gigi..It's nice to know I'm not loosing my mind..dafodil

[Islandgirl]

Hi Dafodil......welcome! I too am 105lbs and breast fed like you. One child for 10 mos the other for 2.5 years and I completely lost everything I had! I have been on individual herbs for about 8 mos and have grown 2.5 inches across the bustline . I also take vitamins and they don't seem to have any effect on my progress. Other members may have more information on this. On the bottle of herbs it tells you how many milligrams is in each tablet, so you can calculate your daily dosages from there. If you look in the routines and (or) the alternatives folder you can get a pretty good idea from there on what is working for others. And yup it can get a little costly. I average approximately $40-50 Canadian dollars per month, but I can say it has been worth it!

Good luck,
Lisa

[dafodil]

Thanks Lisa..I hope that Wahaika didn't totally give up on seeming daftness..I think the herbs made me so dizzy that it took awhile to decipher his wifes routine..I'm beginnnig to make sense of it all..Lisa, what are you using?? and Wahaika ..Thanks again, I think I just need to print out the routine and study..It's funny, I went out and bought some RC and after reading your reply ..I quit using it ..I have one more question, I love to run and ski..do you think BE will still help , because I don't plan on stopping my exercising..Is it a lost cause?? Thanks, Dafodil

[Islandgirl]

My routine is listed below. Don't think skiing should interfere, although running may (don't know for sure) slow your progress.

beboard.proboards23.com/index.cgi?board=Routines&action=display&thread=1089477026

Have fun,
Lisa

[Wahaika]

Hey dafodil,

It looks like you have a handle on the routine. Islandgirl's routine looks pretty good too. Since you are similar in build, pay attention to her dosages and remember that routines are not just a search for what works, but they are also accumulative. i.e. What works in routine attempt #3 is dependent on what was taken in routine attempt #2.

Running will probably hinder your process. If you like to run, increase (like double) your caloric intake. You might get a soft middle, so you can use Yohimburn to counter it. That might not be necessary though.

Fat comes off organs first and goes on last so doing something fat burning like running will probably hinder your progress.

The easy way to think of the routines is in terms of their parts:

* Internal - Herbs, oils, and supplements taken internally by capsule, extract, and tea (infusion).

* External - Herbs, oils, and supplements absorbed transdermally through massage.

Everything falls into those two categories.

The ways to do dosages vary. You can use what someone else used or what a manufacturer recommends.

Another way is to ramp up individual herbs slowly and methodically while watching for signs of growth (itchies, aches, etc.) and do not exceed a maximum. (Greenbush also does this)

Being in tune with your body is important. You need to pay attention, especially because you are so petite. The idea is to fill estrogen receptors and cause fat production in the breasts. When starting out at, say AAA, there is a smaller number of receptors than someone starting out as a B. Further, you have to watch that you don't get too much. This will kick in your negative feedback system and cause your growth to halt - stall. The distance from the lower line of "what works" to the upper line of "too much" is much more delicate and sensitive for those who are petite. So, don't be surprized when your body responds to lower dosages - possibly at or below 1 gram per day, for example.

Saw Palmetto is an exception. Islandgirl had that bumped up close to 5 grams (4800?) as I recall. That is a good idea. It is the only herb you can ramp up higher than 5 grams without stunting your growth. I have not seen anyone exceed 7 grams per day of that one. Usually it is kept at or below 5 grams.

Yep, the rampup is starts on on cycle day 1.

When you stop herbs to do a break. Don't just stop. Ramp them back down over the period of a week. If you get signs of growth during the rampdown, write it down for reference when you are ready to start up again.

Be sure to take a break from all herbs and let your body stabilize. One completely normal cycle may take 3 months to get. Take your time and get your body into a stable conditon first. This is a long process anyway, for most. And even at that, there are no guarantees. My observation though, is that persistence pays.

Good luck,

Wahaika

[dafodil]

Wahaika, you are a scientist! Anyway, My cycle was very normal after the first few days..I was reluctant to stop the herbs completely and so keep doing the liquid tincture 3x a day..Now I feel much more normal but the swellin that I noticed in my breasts seems to have gone away I'm confused about the RC in that you mentioned that you've never seen anyone keep their growth with it but it seems to be included in many routines ..I understand that it helps with the dizzyness ..Anyway, I may be a guinepig for exercising because it is a passion and I probably won't give it up ..maybe cut down a little ..At least cut the running out for a while..I don't seem to have time for full on massage wiht oil so I find myself doing alot of dry massage just here and there..Do you think that will help at all??Thanks for your sugggestions,,By the way , how is your wife progressing?? Dafodil

[Wahaika]

Hello Dafodil,

My wife is progressing well. She is just beginning to incorporate DMSO into the massage and it is working well. If you want to continue exercising and doing BE, DMSO may be something that you will want to consider.

There are a few purposes of massage. Three main ones are to absorb herbs transdermally, elicit prolactin production and help circulation in the lymph node system. Absorbtion of the herbs are the main reason for doing massage. Dry massage is probably not significantly more effective than no massage. On the other hand, it might make a good survey.

As for exercise, if you're burning fat, your chances are slimmer. But again, look into DMSO to try and get the herbs to go deeper.

You might also look into T-Tapping (Did I get that right?). Several on the board did that program and grew at the same time.

Calling all T-tappers....

Wahaika